Você tiraria o produto das prateleiras das lojas para vender diretamente ao consumidor?

Você tiraria o produto das prateleiras das lojas para vender diretamente ao consumidor?

Você tiraria o produto das prateleiras das lojas para vender diretamente ao consumidor?
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Andrew: Olá, lutadores da liberdade. Meu nome é Andrew Warner. Sou o fundador da Mixergy, onde entrevisto empreendedores sobre como eles construíram seus negócios. Juntar-se a mim é uma mulher que estava fazendo tinta, algo que ela faz há anos. E ela realmente colocou sua tinta nas lojas. E há muita conversa sobre negócios diretos para consumidores, mas, enquanto ando pela Target e outras lojas, vejo o que costumava ser direto para produtos de consumo nas prateleiras, como as de Harry. Eles costumavam ser diretos para você, é assim que eles podiam lhe oferecer um preço tão baixo, mas agora, se você quiser usar as lâminas de barbear de Harry, você pode simplesmente atravessar a Target e buscá-la.

Bem, o convidado de hoje fez o oposto. Ela entrou nas lojas, recebeu toda a atenção que você recebe e a legitimidade que aparentemente você recebe por estar nas lojas, e ela disse: “Na verdade, isso não faz sentido. Estou tirando minhas coisas das prateleiras. Vou direto ao consumidor “. Convidei-a aqui para falar sobre como ela está fazendo isso, por que ela está fazendo isso, como ela construiu seus negócios e para aumentar um pouco sua receita. O nome dela é Paula Blankenship. Ela é a fundadora da Heirloom Traditions Paint. Eles são pintados com primer de ligação embutido e cera embutida. Eu tenho que te dizer, eu sei que você está me olhando, Paula, como eu digo isso, porque você pode dizer que eu não sei do que estou falando. Mas ela diz que fez essas tintas para pessoas como eu, que não sabem do que estão falando, que nem sabem pintar, e é por isso que está indo tão bem.

Devo dizer que esta entrevista, onde investigamos o negócio dela, descobre como ela foi patrocinada por dois patrocinadores fenomenais. O primeiro é o HostGator para hospedagem de sites. O segundo é Toptal, para a contratação de desenvolvedores. Paula, é bom ter você aqui.

Paula: Ah, obrigado por me receber aqui e mal posso esperar para falar um pouco mais sobre nossos negócios e como começamos no negócio de tintas, e talvez ajudar você a aprender a pintar aqui.

Andrew: Como você descreveria o que é o Heirloom Traditions Paint?

Paula: Descreveria como um produto de pintura DIY que ajuda as pessoas a obter ótimos resultados, mesmo que não saibam como pintar. Por isso, reunimos as ferramentas e os produtos de uma maneira fácil e fácil de entender, fácil de usar, que produz resultados fenomenais ainda mais do que os clientes desejam. . . Quero dizer, às vezes eles não conseguem acreditar nos resultados que obtêm. Então, acho que entregamos um produto em excesso, então como eles conseguiriam isso neste mundo hoje? Portanto, sempre é ótimo quando você diz às pessoas o quão bom é o seu produto e, quando o obtêm, dizem: “Uau. Isso realmente funciona ”e como um bom. . .

Andrew: E realmente funciona porque parte do problema que tenho com a tinta é primeiro que você deve lixar as coisas, depois colocar uma cartilha, depois colocar a tinta e, aparentemente, colocar outra camada. Isso está certo?

Paula: Muitas pessoas colocam no acabamento. Eles acham que precisam de acabamento para proteger. Mas nosso produto tem tudo. Chamamos isso de tinta tudo em um. E é claro que é onde estamos no allinonepaint.com. Você pode nos encontrar lá, e esse nome já diz tudo, porque tudo o que você precisa está nessa lata. Em outras palavras, tem a. . .

Andrew: Abra, mexa com o que vi no vídeo. Pinte, você despeja. . .

Paula: Pincele.

Andrew: Qual é a receita? Quanto dinheiro você está trazendo? Vamos falar de dólares e centavos, Paula.

Paula: Oh, bem, você sabe, isso parece muito arrogante aqui, mas eu tenho que lhe dizer que começamos isso na minha cozinha há cerca de sete anos com meu filho adolescente, e ele e eu estávamos misturando tinta e colocando-a em latas, chegando a pequenos varejistas, mamãe e pop em todo o país. E, claro, como você sabe, essas lojas estão fechando tão rapidamente quanto abrem e, para acompanhar isso e expandir meus negócios, descobri que isso era muito difícil, apenas para fazê-lo. . .

Andrew: Bem, vamos passar a hora inteira aqui falando sobre a história completa, mas pensei em dar às pessoas uma noção do tamanho para que elas possam entender por que deveriam ouvir.

Paula: Oh, eu peguei você.

Andrew: Quanto você está falando?

Paula: Bem, no momento, estamos fazendo um milhão de dólares por mês em vendas e vendas no atacado. . .

Andrew: Uau.

Paula: Desculpe, varejo, hoje somos varejistas.

Andrew: Nas vendas diretas ao consumidor, todos os meses, os consumidores enviam um milhão de dólares em dinheiro para você ou um milhão de dólares para você e você envia tinta para eles.

Paula: Exatamente. . .

Andrew: Você administrava as lojas de seus pais, as lojas que seus pais começaram logo antes?

Paula: Você sabe, não as lojas que eles criaram, mas os imóveis antigos que eles possuíam. Você sabe, eles estavam no ramo de móveis há cerca de 45, 50 anos da minha vida e, é claro, minha irmã e eu possuímos e operávamos três lojas diferentes nesses locais, em uma pequena cidade no Tennessee.

Andrew: Ah, eles são donos dos edifícios, você é dono das lojas.

Paula: Eles são proprietários dos prédios e, em seguida, colocamos nossa própria versão de uma loja mais modernizada nesses prédios. Por isso, não escolhemos os negócios deles e o administramos com o mesmo nome. Colocamos nossas próprias idéias sobre o que precisávamos estar naquela cidade à medida que nos adaptávamos, e as coisas mudaram e as coisas das pequenas cidades vivem.

Andrew: E então 2008 aconteceu, a crise econômica global. Como isso impactou seus negócios?

Paula: Bem, meus negócios fecharam como uma torneira de água. Apenas passou. . .

Andrew: Tudo de uma vez?

Paula: Tudo de uma vez. Nós sempre tivemos uma ótima vida lá. E, como você sabe, vivendo em cidade pequena, o custo de vida em uma cidade pequena no Tennessee não é o que é em uma cidade grande, mesmo como Louisville. E morando lá, sempre fizemos muito bem. E essas lojas proporcionaram à minha irmã e eu, minha família, ótimas vivências. De repente, passou de 60 para 0. Então, quando isso aconteceu, comecei a tentar descobrir o que fazer. E eu era . . .

Andrew: De 60 o que, 60?

Paula: Estou dizendo que passou de 0 para 60, passou de 60 para 0, então.

Andrew: Sessenta o que? O que os 60 representam? Receita do mês?

Paula: Bem, as pessoas dizem de 0 a 60, estou dizendo isso. . .

Andrew: Oh, entendi. Você está falando sobre a velocidade. Então você está dizendo que isso passou de um negócio veloz e de repente parou de repente. Acho que os empreendedores sempre passam pelo lado emocional disso. Eu tenho que gastar alguns minutos nisso. Você nasceu de empreendedores, foi incentivado a ser empreendedor, é uma criança que cresceu vendendo limonada, vendendo bolos e depois. . . então sua identidade é: “Eu sou um empreendedor. Eu conheço essas coisas. Meus pais são empreendedores. Nós sabemos essas coisas. ” Quando você perde tudo, como isso afeta seu senso de identidade?

Paula: Ah, isso impactaria dramaticamente o senso de si mesmo, e sem dúvida, como eu me vejo nesse ponto porque estava realmente lutando? Eu também estava mudando de casa porque, quando você possui uma loja de móveis, é fácil. . . porque eu era designer, estava sempre trabalhando em casas e assim por diante. Então, eu tinha três casas entrando nessa crise, sem mencionar a minha, para que ninguém pudesse ter nenhum banco, nenhum financiamento para comprar essas propriedades. Então eu estava sofrendo. E eu estava tentando descobrir o que eu faço a seguir, quando isso vai acabar, quando eu posso fazer isso?

E lembro-me de que tudo se resumia ao dia finito disso, sempre que eu estava sentado no mês de julho, pensando: “Tenho dinheiro para me sustentar mais um mês. Depois disso, não sei para onde me virar. ” Eu realmente não. E na minha porta caminha esse homem da cidade de Nova York, e espero ter contado essa história, ele acabou me contratando. E demorou um pouco para que isso acontecesse. Ele acabou me contratando vários meses para isso, e eu comecei a fazer. . .

Andrew: Por que ele queria contratar você? Como, como ele sabia que deveria estar contratando você? Ele acabou de entrar na loja e diz: “Posso contratar você?”

Paula: Bem, demorou um minuto. Mais uma vez, ele simplesmente explodiu na minha porta um dia, ele e a namorada dele, e me disse que havia comprado uma casa na minha cidade para a qual eu tinha sido o designer e que todos os móveis foram vendidos em leilão e alguém disse para ele vir Veja-me. Então ele entra na minha pequena loja sem ninguém negociando, e ele tem toda a minha atenção, obviamente. E eu não tinha ideia de quem ele era. Eu não tinha ideia de que manguito ele tinha. E ele era um típico nova-iorquino e um cara legal. Mas, você sabe, ele é muito ousado para minha cidade natal. Então ele disse: “Venha me ajudar”, e eu comecei a trabalhar com ele em sua casa e a colocar móveis, tapetes, arte e assim por diante.

E a próxima coisa que você sabe, ele disse: “Ei, você poderia subir e fazer um prédio para mim em Cleveland, Ohio”? Eu subi e vi isso, não podia acreditar que ele era o dono. Eu estava em choque. E eu fiquei tipo, “Uau, esse cara é de verdade.” E logo que você sabe, ele disse: “Venha para Danbury, Connecticut. Eu comprei um prédio lá e tem um milhão e meio de metros quadrados. ” E eu fiquei tipo, “Você é o dono?” Ele disse: “Sim, eu sou o proprietário”. Acontece que ele comprou o antigo prédio da Union Carbide lá, que eles construíram seu escritório em Danbury. E ele comprou como o único proprietário disso. . . uma das maiores transações em todo o estado para. . . mesmo na área de Nova York. E ele comprou este prédio. Então, ele e eu reviramos este prédio por cerca de cinco anos. Trabalhamos em todas as áreas comuns. E meu último cliente foi a General Motors. Então isso se tornou uma grande coisa para mim, e eu fiz isso por vários anos.

Andrew: Entendi. Então, Paula, ele viu que você era. . . como se chama, vestiários ou casas de arrumação, casas de espetáculos, é isso.

Paula: Projetando-os.

Andrew: Você está projetando casas. Então ele disse: “Você pode vir projetar um lugar para mim?” e então um lugar se transformou em outro e em outro.

Paula: Foi apenas uma benção, quero dizer, uma bênção absoluta que esse cara tenha explodido na minha porta quando o fez. O momento era apenas um momento imaculado para que isso acontecesse.

Andrew: E você fechou sua loja.

Paula: Eu fiz.

Andrew: Você se tornou um funcionário deste bilionário ou o quê?

Paula: Eu era um empreiteiro, mas sim. Eu fui [inaudible 00:08:33] . . .

Andrew: Um empreiteiro.

Paula: Hum-hmm. Quero dizer, ele estava me dizendo o que fazer, quando fazer, quando parar e quando partir.

Andrew: Você se sentiu bem com a transição porque sentiu: “Estou salvo. Pelo menos, não vou me comprometer financeiramente “?

Paula: Eu fiz, você sabe.

Andrew: Foi o que foi.

Paula: Eu olhei absolutamente como você disse, o lado emocional aqui foi como obrigado, Senhor, por enviar esse homem pelo meu caminho, e espero que eu possa ganhar a vida fazendo isso, é claro [inaudible 00:08:54].

Andrew: E não tem vergonha de ser um empreendedor que agora é um funcionário.

Paula: Sim. Bem, novamente, eu não era funcionário. Eu ainda estava atuando como designer e, em seguida, disse a ele que tinha ótimos leads no setor de revestimentos para pisos e mostrarei exemplos. E ele finalmente estava comprando seus suprimentos para eu reformar esses enormes edifícios. Então, eu estava realmente atuando como um fornecedor para ele e um designer. Então, deixei que ele escolhesse meus materiais e, se ele pudesse comprá-los de mim, ele o fez, e se não o fizesse, ele os compraria de outra pessoa.

Andrew: Entendi.

Paula: Então eu trabalhei a partir desses ângulos para que eu pudesse me sair bem.

Andrew: O que aconteceu com ele?

Paula: Ele foi morto em um acidente de carro em seu aniversário de 50 anos, na verdade. . .

Andrew: Apenas atravessando a rua?

Paula: Não. Ele estava voltando da academia para casa. E eu não sei se ele. . . Acho que ele teve um ataque cardíaco e atingiu um poste de telefone bem no meio da cidade onde morava e foi morto naquele acidente de carro. Tão trágico, muito trágico.

Andrew: Você pode dizer qual é o nome dele?

Paula: Mas eu já havia saído da empresa naquela época e já estava trabalhando no meu negócio de tintas. Então ele e eu meio que nos separamos. E ele estava doente comigo por deixá-lo no meio do projeto em algo disso. . . você sabe, o relacionamento chegou a um fim de mente, então meio que nos separamos um pouco, então eu comecei essa empresa, essa empresa de tintas na minha cozinha. Então, eu estava tentando ter algo em que recorrer, que não precisava viajar tanto para o norte, então comecei isso. . .

Andrew: Quantos anos seu filho tinha naquela época?

Paula: Meu filho estava apenas começando o ensino médio. Então ele tinha 15, 16 anos, em algum lugar lá. Então ele era meu único ajudante.

Andrew: Você pode dizer qual é o nome desse bilionário?

Paula: Sim. Glen Nelson era o nome dele. Glen Nelson.

Andrew: O que ele fez? Qual era o negócio dele? Eu não o conheço.

Paula: Sua empresa se chamava Matrix. E ele estava comprando grandes propriedades comerciais, e ele entrava e olhava realmente para descobrir o que estava doente do prédio e dos inquilinos e assim por diante, e apenas começava. . .

Andrew: Que pessoa perfeita para você conhecer então.

Paula: Ele era a pessoa perfeita para eu conhecer. E eu aprendi a rolar com aquela equipe porque, sabe, aqueles caras que ele tinha em sua equipe eram, antes de tudo, muitos homens do norte com boa educação, boa formação. Ele próprio não tinha formação, mas era a pessoa de rua mais inteligente que já conheci em minha vida e tenho certeza de que nunca encontrarei ninguém para chegar perto disso. Você sabe, ele simplesmente não tinha medo de nada. Ele não chegou aonde havia chegado em sua vida por não ter chances de correr riscos. Então ele era a pessoa perfeita para assistir e aprender.

Andrew: Você não terminou a escola. Como seus pais se sentiram? . .

Paula: Eu não fiz.

Andrew: Você não. Como seus pais se sentiram sobre isso?

Paula: Não. Eu não. Bem, pense de onde eu sou, uma comunidade rural no Tennessee, e, você sabe, eu quase nem acenei a porta da escola, odiei cada minuto dela. E eu sempre soube que tinha um grande talento e sempre soube que tinha os meios para fazer qualquer coisa. E meus pais tiveram uma infância pouco ortodoxa porque eram empreendedores e definitivamente nos ensinaram que qualquer coisa que você queira fazer, pode fazer e apenas seguir em frente. Eles sempre nos deram o apoio e sempre nos ajudaram a financiar negócios.

E, você sabe, meu pai nos deu US $ 10.000 quando eu tinha 16 anos e disse: “Ei, vá para Chicago e compre. . . “Eu tenho que te contar, essa é uma pequena história louca e isso conta o meu histórico e a coisa toda. Mas decidimos que queríamos abrir. . . minha irmã e eu abrimos uma loja de roupas porque gostávamos de roupas. Queríamos vender essas mercadorias devolvidas, como as chamamos de volta no dia. Foi quando as lojas eram muito populares. Mas havia uma pequena loja que nos abriu a algumas horas de carro. Nós ouvimos sobre isso. Nós fomos lá. E o material era da Spiegel, se você conhece a empresa Spiegel de Chicago.

E assim fizemos uma pequena pesquisa. Não havia internet, obviamente, então você tinha que ligar para a operadora e perguntar ao telefone. E lembre-se, tenho 16 anos, estou ligando, minha irmã tem 18 anos e estou na escola, supostamente, e estou chamando as informações. . . telefonando para o operador e pedindo informações, tentando obter informações sobre Spiegel, finalmente chama alguém, o cara diz: “Ei, sim, você pode subir e comprar esses retornos”. Se você encomendou, não coube, eles não o colocaram novamente no inventário. Eles apenas jogam na lixeira. Então eles tinham marcas realmente sofisticadas.

Então, meu pai nos dá US $ 10.000 e diz: “Ei, vá lá em cima e veja”, em dinheiro, em dinheiro. Então minha irmã e eu entramos em um carro. Dirigimos o carro da minha mãe, ainda não sabemos por que fizemos isso, mas subimos até lá e vamos ver esse Sr. Fox, é o nome dele e só precisamos dizer a ele que queremos comprar US $ 10.000 . Ele nos entrega esses manifestos e nos diz: “Qual deles você quer?” e escolhemos aqueles que pensamos que somos [inaudible 00:13:20], alugue um caminhão, faça o backup e leve-o para casa. Ele disse: “Oh, leva cerca de uma semana para carregar o caminhão”. É como uma semana, não tínhamos ideia. Então, temos que ficar, e ficamos lá em Chicago.

Enfim, acabamos dirigindo um caminhão de 7 metros. Acabo dirigindo a caminhonete para o Tennessee com isso, você sabe. . . e minha irmã acabou fugindo e me deixando na estrada. E então eu dirigi para casa sozinha e ela dirigiu para casa sozinha. Ela se assustou na cidade porque alguém caminhou até suas janelas, assustou-a para que ela seguisse em frente e me deixasse. E, novamente, 16 anos dirigindo este caminhão, ela alugou.

E, de qualquer forma, essa foi apenas uma pequena aventura. Eu apenas olho para trás e não consigo imaginar isso. . . dar ao meu filho o equivalente a isso hoje provavelmente seria de US $ 50.000 e dizer-lhe para sair e dirigir e conseguir algo, você sabe, nessa idade. Mas de qualquer maneira, eu podia acreditar que poderíamos fazer qualquer coisa, e hoje olho para trás e digo: “Uau”. Eu acho que porque eles nos deram as asas para falhar e assim por diante, que eu nunca me vi como não sendo capaz de fazer o que eu queria, então. Talvez seja uma coisa boa.

Andrew: Como você decidiu que queria pintar? De onde veio a ideia?

Paula: Bem, porque eu sempre tive minhas mãos pintadas. . . você sabe, eu sou um artista. Eu desenho, pinto e tudo isso. Eu sempre tive um pincel na mão. Eu sempre soube que a tinta era uma ótima maneira de atualizar seu interior. E uma das ferramentas mais baratas da caixa, se você estiver redesenhando sua casa, é a tinta. Então eu vendi tinta. Você sabe, uma das lojas que eu e minha irmã possuíamos era uma loja de revestimento de pisos e vendemos tinta. Então, eu tive a ideia de que queria fazer algum tipo de negócio on-line para poder receber pedidos, atender a esses pedidos e pintar esses móveis que eu compraria. Eu comprava como uma mobília desmontável em uma caixa, pintava uma variedade de cores que eu ia mostrar no meu site e deixava as pessoas escolherem uma cor. Eu ia pintar os móveis, depois colocá-los de volta na caixa e enviá-los a eles como uma ideia de designer. Esse foi o meu MO inteiro.

E eu criei um cartão colorido, e essas seriam minhas cores de tinta. Eu postei isso na minha página do Facebook. E a partir disso, alguém me procurou e me perguntou se poderiam comprar um pouco dessa tinta. Bem, a tinta não existia naquele momento. Foram apenas as cores. E eu disse: “Claro”, percebendo que “Ei, este é o começo disso. Então deixe-me deixar alguém comprar tinta, e eu vou ter que fazer uma grande parte dessa tinta. Então, talvez isso ajude meus mínimos aqui. Então eu digo a ela e ela disse: “Claro. Vou comprar um pouco. ” Então ela comprou alguns, e a próxima coisa que você sabe, ela estava vendendo. E eu fiquei tipo, “Oh, uau. Ela está vendendo. ” Então outra senhora me perguntou o mesmo e isso continuou a crescer e como um louco.

Oh, eu tinha 50 varejistas em seis meses. Eu estava cobrando US $ 1.200 por uma variedade por atacado dessas tintas, e isso é o suficiente para entrar em negócios comigo, e eu daria a eles um território de qualquer quilometragem ao seu redor e assim por diante. Foi assim que eu comecei, e ele decolou.

Andrew: Ela tinha uma loja e queria vendê-la em sua loja, e você disse: “Você pode vendê-lo em sua loja, e você tem exclusividade nesta tinta que eu apenas imaginei e inventei aqui porque você queria comprar. que você tem exclusividade somente nessa pequena área. ”

Paula: Foi assim que fiz aqui. Foi exatamente o que eu fiz.

Andrew: Como você conseguiu a tinta? Ouvi dizer que era uma história interessante.

Paula: É uma história interessante simplesmente por causa da gênese de como isso aconteceu. Então, quando essa garota me diz que quer comprar essa tinta, fico pensando: “Oh, Deus, bem, você não. . . “Eu percebi que era a época dos impostos do ano e conhecia essa garota, cresci com ela e pensei:” Sabe, eu não quero o dinheiro dela, porque e se? . . “Você sabe, eu não quero receber o dinheiro dela, e isso não acontece. Então eu disse: “Você me paga quando eu entregar a você.” O pai do meu filho morava na minha cidade natal e é daí que a garota era. Eu disse: “Bem, eu trarei a você a tinta quando ele vier visitar o pai dele quando eu o derrubar.” Então ela disse: “Claro”.

Então, eu vou fazer essa tinta agora, porque agora tenho uma missão. Eu tenho um cliente. Então, comecei a pensar e pensávamos que costumávamos pagar uma fatura a uma empresa aqui em Louisville quando tínhamos que pintar em nossa loja de varejo, e eu acreditava que elas eram de Louisville. E eu olho na internet e lembro com certeza o nome, e lá estava a empresa, vendida para alguém na Califórnia. Liguei para a empresa na Califórnia, perguntei sobre a empresa com sede em Louisville e ele disse: “Sim, uma pequena parte desse negócio de família ainda está em funcionamento hoje. Você deveria ligar para eles.

Então eu ligo para eles, desço e os encontro. E eis que essa família que possuía esse negócio lembrou-se de nossa conta e lembrou-se de estarmos no negócio e lembrou-se do antigo representante de vendas, continua a longa história. Eu dou a eles a tinta. Eu digo que quero fazer uma tinta do tipo giz e dei a eles um exemplo de uma que estava prontamente disponível. E eu acho que vou fazer uma análise química dessa tinta e algo assim, começa a gastar muito dinheiro, é exatamente isso que eu estava pensando, e o cara tira a tampa e apenas dá um cheiro a ele . Ele diz: “Claro, eu os faria”. Eu disse: “Então essa é a análise química disso?” Ele disse: “Sim, nós podemos fazer isso. Isso é apenas uma pintura de casa. Eu estava tipo, “Sério?” Ele disse: “Sim”.

Então eu fiquei tipo, “Não. Meu Deus, certamente isso é mais do que isso ”, você sabe. De qualquer forma, não demorou muito, ele me ligou de volta, e eu pensei que eles pensavam que eu era louco quando saí, e eles me ligaram de volta e disseram: “Desça e pegue sua amostra” e eu disse: “Você sabe o que, vamos fazer isso. E eu não vou pintar com isso. Apenas faça.” Ele disse: “Isso é melhor do que você tem, que você nos trouxe”. Então eu disse: “Bem, isso é ótimo.” Então, eu o coloquei no eBay imediatamente com os pedaços de tinta que ele me deu, tirei a garota da tinta e comecei a usá-la, e os varejistas continuavam chegando até pelo eBay. As pessoas compravam o produto e eu tinha medo de olhar. . .

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Andrew: Uau. O que havia de tão especial nisso? Existem muitas outras empresas de tintas. Você é novo em folha.

Paula: Tem.

Andrew: O que fez sua listagem do eBay se destacar?

Paula: Bem, essa era uma tinta tipo giz na época. Então, meu produto evoluiu. Naquela época, eu estava fazendo uma tinta lisa e calcária. Eu também gosto . .

Andrew: Vou perguntar o que é isso daqui a pouco. Deixe-me dedicar um momento apenas para dizer a todos, meu patrocinador é o HostGator. Se você está empolgado com o empreendedorismo, está empolgado com isso e deseja continuar, não há lugar melhor para obter um site do que acessar hostgator.com/mixergy. Se você selecionar essa opção do meio, eles fornecerão domínios ilimitados. Portanto, toda pequena ideia que você tem, sem ter que descobrir como faço para criar um site, como faço para que tudo funcione, basta ir ao HostGator, depois de ter essa conta, e simplesmente criá-la, da maneira que um artista, se tiverem um bloco de papel, pode começar a desenhar. Depois de obter esse bloco de papel, qualquer idéia pode começar a ser executada. Hostgator.com/mixergy, preço super baixo, ainda mais baixo se você usar o meu URL / mixergy, e incrivelmente confiável. Eu estou com eles agora há anos. Eu recomendo que você vá para hostgator.com/mixergy.

Eles obtiveram uma lista de todos esses benefícios, como concederão US $ 100 em créditos de anúncios no Google. Sabe, eu não estou aqui para vender recursos, estou aqui para dizer para você começar algo. E se você for ao HostGator, seria ótimo para mim, para ser honesto com você, porque eles são patrocinadores, e seria ótimo para você, porque eles lhe ofereceriam um preço baixo e eles ‘ Você cuida bem do seu site, hostgator.com/mixergy.

O que é essa coisa de giz? Interrompi intencionalmente porque sei desde antes de começarmos que isso é fundamental, giz, giz, giz, qual foi a primeira versão que você criou que era tão especial?

Paula: Bem, era muito calcário e achatado, o que significava que precisava ter um revestimento de cera em cima. E, é claro, eu crio minha própria fórmula de cera no fogão, cozinhando cera.

Andrew: Então essa foi sua ideia. Você disse: “Olha, pessoas como essa sensação de giz, mas obviamente não podem ter uma parede de giz onde, quando a tocam, ficam com poeira nas mãos. Mas eu sei como fazer a cera. Isso é o que era?

Paula: Hum-hmm. Bem, meu produto, em vez de paredes e lousa, era para móveis. Portanto, você não deseja que seus móveis sejam secos, ásperos e calcários. Então você quer dar a ela uma aparência antiga ou antiga, e faz isso usando um produto de cera. E foi exatamente isso que criei foi uma cera e fiz cores. . .

Andrew: Ah, então foi a combinação que você deu às pessoas com a tinta que você imaginou e sabia como era porque vendeu móveis por muito tempo, mas também conseguiu criar a cera por cima . Entendi. Então as pessoas no eBay compraram. Foram US $ 1.200 para a primeira mulher amiga sua que o encontrou no Facebook. Quanto você começou a trazer do eBay?

Paula: É engraçado, meu objetivo era US $ 100 por dia. Eu disse que se eu puder ganhar US $ 100 por dia, US $ 3.000 por mês, será o suficiente para eu brincar aqui e dar ao meu filho algo divertido de fazer depois da escola, e [inaudible 00:21:07] . . .

Andrew: Então era um negócio paralelo.

Paula: Meu filho, meu filho. . .

Andrew: Não, mas era um negócio paralelo porque você ainda estava pensando. . .

Paula: Era um lado, sim, um negócio paralelo.

Andrew: Sim, entendi que era bonito. . . mas você estava pensando: “Eu ainda recebo este emprego, estou trabalhando com este Nortista.

Paula: Eu fui.

Andrew: Esse cara e todos os seus amigos. Vou trabalhar com eles, mas isso trará um bom dinheiro e meu filho entrará em empreendedorismo. ” Você fez pelo seu filho o que seus pais fizeram por você, assim, lhes deu esse tipo de experiência?

Paula: Eu fiz muito disso com meu filho. A única coisa que fiz. . .

Andrew: Quão? Eu gostaria de fazer isso com meus filhos. Eles são cinco e três. Estou em um ponto em que eu poderia começar. O que você fez com seu filho?

Paula: Bem, uma coisa que eu aposto que minha mãe sempre fazia, mesmo que estivéssemos. . . mais uma vez, dando-nos todo esse incentivo, ela sempre viajou com minha irmã, eu e quem mais queríamos levar. Ela nos levou por todo o mundo. E mesmo sendo uma cidade do interior de uma cidade pequena, ela era esperta o suficiente, sabia de negócios o suficiente para saber que isso abriria nossos olhos para o mundo. E fez. E também vamos ver que, você sabe, diferentes diversidades ao redor do mundo e como todos são diferentes culturalmente e tudo isso. Então, por esse motivo, eu disse com meu próprio filho, vou viajar com ele, e acho que isso deu a ele uma perspectiva diferente do mundo.

Andrew: Como o quê? O que você recebeu? Parece divertido e há uma sensação de outras pessoas por aí. Entendi. Meu mundo está se ampliando, minha visão do que é possível está se ampliando. Mas, substancialmente, o que muda porque ele é capaz de ver isso? Você tem um exemplo de algo diferente? . . ?

Paula: Oh, centenas de coisas mudam. Eu acho que tudo muda.

Andrew: Me dê um exemplo, o que é diferente? O que é diferente?

Paula: Bem, acho que porque, às vezes, se você se senta na poltrona e olha ao redor do mundo e diz: “Todo mundo é muito mais esperto do que eu. Todo mundo está em um lugar tão melhor do que eu. “Não posso entrar no ramo da moda porque não moro em Paris”. “Não posso ser presidente porque não moro na cidade certa”, ou o que seja. Você não pode limitar seu pensamento. E uma vez que eu acho que você chega lá e vê o resto do mundo, você diz: “Sabe, eles não são diferentes do que eu.” Você pode ser o que quiser. Sua geografia não contém ou impede você de ser quem você quer ser. Então eu acho que quando as pessoas viajam, elas veem isso, e veem que vivemos no melhor país do mundo. E eles vêem que qualquer coisa que queremos fazer, temos a capacidade de fazer neste país.

Então, acredito que viajar é um grande revelador para as crianças, e mesmo que elas provavelmente não desejem ir. Eu não levava meu filho à praia o tempo todo. Então isso foi uma coisa que eu não fiz. E ainda não sei. . .

Andrew: Intencionalmente.

Paula: Ainda vou à praia, mas não o levo. . . Eu não o levei a essas viagens. Levei-o para a Europa e o levei a lugares importantes. Eu o levei ao Vaticano. Levei-o a lugares em que ele podia ver coisas que estão tão distantes de seu próprio mundo. E eu acho que isso fez dele uma pessoa diferente. Ele ainda se vê como alguém que quer continuar viajando e gosta de mim, mas acho que com o tempo, à medida que ele cresce e fica mais velho, ele descobre que isso também foi muito revelador para ele. E ele fará seus próprios filhos do jeito que eu espero,

Andrew: Eu estava contando aos meus filhos uma história ontem à noite sobre como levamos nosso gato para a Argentina, muito antes de eles nascerem, e um dia nosso gato caiu pela janela porque ele se sentou na janela que estava aberta e se comportou bem por um longo tempo, e um dia ele caiu. Não conseguimos encontrá-lo. Imprimi uma foto de um gato que parecia com o nosso. Comecei a andar por aí. Eu usei o Google Translate para traduzir o arquivo “Lost our cat. Se você puder encontrá-los, ligue para o nosso número ”, coloque-o em uma placa, ande e mostre-o para as pessoas no meu espanhol ruim. E então uma pessoa entendeu, me mostrou onde estava o gato, debaixo do carro. O gato quebrou um osso. Tivemos que encontrar um hospital. E para eles, era como. . .

Paula: Inacreditável.

Andrew: Sim. Então essa foi apenas uma história interessante que os deixou saber um pouco sobre seus pais antes de nascerem. Mas isso também me lembrou que, quando você mora em um país diferente, tudo é possível descobrir e, a cada momento, que, no final, quando você passa, sente uma força por ter superado isso, por tendo superado: “Como pergunto a esses estranhos onde está meu gato? Com quem posso falar aqui? Como encontro um hospital para o gato? O que eu explico para o gato? . . “

Paula: Cem por cento.

Andrew:. . . para o hospital o que aconteceu. ” Em todos esses momentos, é apenas a vida cotidiana. Ir e pegar um croissant no café da manhã é interessante porque eles vendem medialunas, não vendem croissants. E se você pedir um café, eles não sabem o que é um café. E esta é a Argentina, é. . .

Paula: É o que eu amo em viagens.

Andrew: Isso é o que eu amo sobre isso.

Paula: Desafia você. Isso te desafia muito. Quando eu viajo agora. . . Recentemente, fui a Cingapura sozinho e nunca fui à Ásia e sempre quis ir. Eu vou para Kuala Lumpur, você sabe. Eu provavelmente teria dito não a essa viagem, indo para Cingapura, e disse: “Sabe, por que eu não iria? Não há nada que eu tenha medo. Eu não conheço uma única pessoa. ” Também fui para Dubai e fui para o Oriente Médio, não sozinha, fui com alguém lá.

Andrew: Eu também fui para Cingapura. Aqui estão algumas coisas que obtive dele. Number one, the most impactful thing was I thought having closed-caption TVs everywhere would feel like an oppressive government watching you all the time, and I’m not saying that it’s great, I’m not passing any judgment, I walked into it with this judgment. And then I realized, as I was running through streets that I didn’t recognize at all, I’d see these women walking around by themselves sometimes, sometimes in threes, wearing red . . . not skimpy clothes, but just like not worried about what they were wearing and where they were. And I said, “I’ve traveled now all over the world. I don’t remember another country where women could on their own, at night in these little corners of the city, just go walking on their own, and feel comfortable and feel a sense of lightness.”

Paula: Feel safe.

Andrew: Feel safe. Now, for me, all I saw was the oppression, for them . . . and I’ve talked to people in Singapore, they feel a sense of pride that they are protected by this. Now, that was an eye-opener culturally to see that.

Paula: Absolutely.

Andrew: I have tons of examples. What did you get out of going to Singapore?

Paula: Oh, you know, looking back, it’s a hell of a way.

Andrew: It’s what?

Paula: It’s a hell of a long way. I know that . . .

Andrew: It is very far. Yes.

Paula: You know, I went there too . . . it was my travel product that I invented that I have a patent for actually, and the Tax Free World Association voted my product as one of the best travel products or one of the best products in 2018. So I was there for the awards banquet. Of course, it didn’t win, but I was there just with myself and another product. So I was there to represent my product. But I learned a lot going there. I learned that traveling alone is very adventurous, and I did feel a sense of accomplishment just to navigate all that and to get home in one piece. And I really felt very much like I had conquered the world when I got home, you know.

Andrew: I just wrote a note to myself to come back and ask you about the travel product. But I realized that we’re also getting off the story here because I had to tell you stories about my trip and find out about your son . . .

Paula: I like hearing your stories. This makes it a two-way street. I mean, I like it.

Andrew: I like that. I like getting the chance to share them. You were then saying . . . I think I got something here, “I’m going to go into other stores.” Did you get into Walmart? Did you try to get into Walmart?

Paula: You know, I didn’t because we quickly learned . . . and I am one of those people, we got into Camping World, if you’re familiar with Camping World. I met Marcus Lemonis in Chicago . . .

Andrew: What is it?

Paula: Camping World is a chain of stores that sell to people who are camping enthusiasts. They sell everything from campers themselves, motorhomes of all facets, and then all the supplies. And they have locations around the [inaudible 00:28:23], up to about 82 store fronts. And Marcus Lemonis is a business entrepreneur himself and Lee Iacocca was one of his mentors early on in his career. And of course, he’s a very brilliant person, and then I’ll give him all the accolades in the world, but the Camping World organization kind of burnt me on how retailers work today. So I will give you . . .

Andrew: What do you mean? You got into Camping World?

Paula: Got into Camping World, got our product on the shelves and on . . .

Andrew: What was it like to get your product into . . . Why is Camping World? What do they have to do with paint?

Paula: Well, because I have a product that paints leathers and vinyls. And you can paint literally anything inside your camper. So if your camper is looking old and dowdy, you can paint the walls which are covered with vinyl most of the time. So my product is flexible. This paint, this all-in-one paint that I’m telling you about, you can paint leather or vinyl. You can paint the cabinets, paint the countertops. You can paint pretty much any surface inside that home to make it look brand new. So Camping World loved it for that. You can paint the driver’s seat if you want to make your seats look brand new, and they don’t crack and all that.

Andrew: Got it. OK.

Paula: Was a great product.

Andrew: So you got in there.

Paula: Got in there.

Andrew: This was fantastic, except? O que aconteceu?

Paula: You think. It was very good. Parece bom. We also got into their catalog that goes out to all of these . . . I forgot, a couple, three million people have the catalog that every year, or bi-annually, whatever, they send this catalog out, we had a listing in the catalog. We were known to be part of their group, let’s say, and they got a discount for buying from the Camping World organization. If you’re a member like Sam’s Club, you could be in the Good Sam’s Club actually, the Good Sam club. So we were in all of that. We gave discounts and heavy discounts to be in those stores and to put our product where people can walk in and buy it off of the shelf, what you think is where you want your product to be.

But unfortunately, that’s not how it works today. Every retailer . . . this is my own experience, and I’ll just tell you how I feel about it. And I could be wrong, but I’m going to tell you right now the numbers speak for themselves. So here we are giving our product at a huge discount to retailers to get it on the shelf. I’m sending my product into these stores, hoping that it’s on the shelf. So I start talking to all of my six million followers that I have on my social pages, and I’m directing my customers to go into Camping World and buy it in their hometown, walk in and pick it up and buy it.

Andrew: Why are you doing that? Aren’t they supposed to do that? It’s their store.

Paula: Well, you would think. But they don’t. They don’t. They think because they put it into a catalog that now all of a sudden that it will speak. I don’t know how they think it’s . . . again, so this is how I came up with this idea, all right. So I’m directing my customers to find this now, hoping to make their life more convenient by putting it on the shelves. We’re actually getting into Tractor Supply, and I turned down the order. So we already had been approved to go into Tractor Supply, which is a lot of locations.

So this is when I made the turn away from retail right here. So Camping World puts the product on the shelf and puts it in all of the store supposedly, and we’re telling everybody to go get it there and come to find out my customers were going there, these people that I’ve talked to everyday online we’re going into these stores only to find that they hadn’t even set the product on the shelf yet. So we’re disappointed. They’d driven there to get it, got out of the car, went in to get it so now highly disappointed.

Camping World is only willing to put in six colors to test this. So now, I offer 30 colors, they only have 6, so just wouldn’t you know that this customer can’t find the color they’re looking for. I’m talking about all 30 colors, now this store only has 6. So they’re already disappointed again.

And so here’s what ultimately happened, and this is how retailers work today and you can take this to the bank because this is exactly what they do and this is including Do it Best, this is exactly what they did. Once they were able to buy my product wholesale at this discount that I gave them so they would put it on the shelf for the convenience of the customer, they then go to the internet and they beat you up and sell under you on Amazon, even if it’s through stores names that they set up that don’t reflect that it’s Do it Best or that it’s Camping World online. They backdoor you . . .

Andrew: So what you’re saying is Camping World had another brand online that they personally are selling? It’s not even their people who are maybe taking it and selling it . . . ?

Paula: It is their people. It is them doing, but they don’t put their name on it.

Andrew: Like, they’re not freelancing this people? Não?

Paula: They’re doing it to all their people.

Andrew: You’re saying they, as a company have a . . .

Paula: One hundred percent intentional. Yes.

Andrew: How did you discover that they were doing it themselves, or you just saw it on the store and then assuming that it’s them?

Paula: Bought it from them. It’s online.

Andrew: You bought it? And you saw the shipping label was from them?

Paula: Uh-huh. Just got right online and bought it from them and that’s exactly how we figured it out. Yes.

Andrew: So what you realized was, “I have to sell, I have to then send people to the store. When they get to the store, they don’t have a great experience because a lot of the product is not there, just whatever the store decided to offer. And then they come in and they undercut me on what they have with online sales.” And you said, “What do I need this just to flatter myself and feel good and worthy as a business person and creator, who sees their stuff in stores and can boast that I’m in the store?” You said, “I don’t want to do this.”

Paula: I’m done.

Andrew: You decided, “I’m going to pull it all and go online.” The first thing I did was go to Amazon directly yourself, or did you start selling more on eBay, or on your own website? Which one?

Paula: Well, we’re no longer on eBay. That was a long time ago. I haven’t been on eBay in a long time.

Andrew: You pulled eBay a long time ago.

Paula: All Amazon, 100% Amazon. Amazon is the way.

Andrew: You said, “I’m going to go 100% Amazon”?

Paula: I’m going to go my website and 100% Amazon as well.

Andrew: And that’s it. And you had just those two.

Paula: So everything’s on Amazon, all products are on Amazon. So we were in Prime for two days. Now, we’re in one day shipping. So we’re down to getting it, you can order it today and somebody will walk it in your door the next day. So some things that were holding us back from the surety that customers needed was a sprayed on color card, meaning I’ve got to give them an example of exactly what this color looks like in reality. The only thing that a retail store offered me that I wasn’t able to give this online customer was a sample of that paint. So those are very expensive to create, but we bit the bullet, we did it, now we have this sprayed on color card.

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So now, the customer can get a sample from me for $6.99. We send it to them free shipping. I mean, they pay the shipping, we send the sample for free for $6.99, and inside that sample comes this color strip of all the colors. So once they get that, try it, now they can order with the surety that they’re getting the color that they’ve already seen. So that was the only thing keeping us and making us want to reach to retail was because people can’t . . . because the monitor says it looks bright red, it may not be that color because your monitor may not be showing it exactly how it looks in reality. So now that we’ve solved that quandary for people, they can buy everything online from us with an assurance that they’re going to get the color that they need, so.

Andrew: You know what, so last night, I don’t know what it is . . . I know what it is with me. I always worry that I’m going to be like some of these other entrepreneur podcast, gets snowed by someone, claimed that they’re doing great but they don’t really exist. So literally, I put the kids to sleep last night, and I just started looking around to see, “Is she for real? Do people like her product? Is she trying to like use me as a way of pretending that she’s got this great product to get another Google hit? Eu não sei.” I looked it up and I know one of the things I saw . . .

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Paula: I’m glad. I want you to.

Andrew: Oh yeah, I even saw old videos of you which like you didn’t call yourself the founder in the video. You called yourself . . . let me see what the title is . . .

Paula: Creative director.

Andrew: Creative director.

Paula: I still call myself that, by the way.

Andrew: Okay. This was like from 2015. It’s you telling people how to stir the paint. Anyway, here’s one thing that I’m so glad that I saw, page three or four of Google, I see that Walmart does sell your product, and of course, for me, it wasn’t this Walmart sell your product or not, it was do people like the product or is this some kind of BS thing that we’re now getting hyped for? No, they do. It’s 60 reviews. That’s the thing that I registered last night. Today I’m registering, it is for sale on walmart.com. Quão?

Paula: Well, those are pushed channels from Do it Best, and I don’t think they’ve taken them off yet. So actually Walmart doesn’t even own, touch the product. It’s just Do it Best . . .

Andrew: Somebody else was listing it.

Paula: The hardware store was pushing it through to Jet, Walmart, all of those channels. So anywhere you go . . .

Andrew: It’s listed from Glidden High Endurance Plus. Do you know them, or is this like another brand . . . ?

Paula: Mm-mm.

Andrew: No.

Paula: No.

Andrew: That is one of the problems where it’s someone else then . . . Oh, no, I take it back. I got totally snowed. Oh, no, no, no, the first link was you, this is somebody else creating something like you. The first link was you and it was listed as out of sale. Entendi. This is someone else. That’s another problem with online sales, the people are then creating knockoffs. There was Wirecutter, The New York Times’ evaluation site that just showed how they bought the real thing from Amazon and the fake thing too, and you can’t tell them apart. It was only their research that helped them tell it apart. So your stuff is being sold here. I can see it. I also see people who are knocking you off. But is that an issue for you?

Paula: Knocking me off from what?

Andrew: Creating like fake versions of you, and then Walmart has a reason to encourage people to buy the fake stuff.

Paula: That has to be the push channel. You know, if they are, they’re going to be pending a lawsuit here. I will say that.

Andrew: It’s like knockoff, but the name is just close enough that I was tricked as I was looking quickly. So yeah . . .

Paula: Really?

Andrew: All right, it doesn’t . . . I’m just pushing to see . . .

Paula: You’re going to make me go look.

Andrew: You should go look. I could see you want to go look right now.

Paula: Oh, I do occasionally, but not that hard. I don’t go to page three. Maybe I need to get past page one and two.

Andrew: I do it all the time. I want to see what people are burying. You know, it really bothers me when I listen to another podcast and there’s . . . like they’re talking up somebody and I know that . . . I can’t stop researching them. I know that they’re full of it. And the thing that I want sometimes is I want to call people out and go, “This person has nothing,” but I can’t.

Paula: No. And you’re just outing them out for nothing. Certo. Exatamente. I agree with you. Boa. You do your research.

Andrew: I got to support the entrepreneur. I can’t. There’s only one like VPN company that just drives me nuts. I look to see who the founder of the . . . before I traveled internationally, and when I got a VPN I said, “I don’t know these countries. I don’t know all these different internet services that I’m connecting to on Wi Fi. I’ll go get a VPN.” I checked out this one VPN company, all the podcasters are talking about them. And I said, “All right, I’ll sign up,” I paid. This was like before a trip to Asia, I got to have something.

And then I realized, wait a minute, I think this company is owned by a Chinese company, and you know the Chinese government is watching it. And so I messaged him, I said, “Who owns this company?” And they said, “Well, we have a really good service.” I go, “Yes. Who owns it?” “Well, we run out of this European location.” I go, “I talked to enough founders to know that there’s ways to make your stuff obviously look like it’s in London. How many new entrepreneurs I talked to who day one, they have a London office”?

Paula: Huawei. Huawei, they’re in London.

Andrew: Yeah. They’re in London too. Exatamente. So you can just be open with me. I’ve no problem with you being a Chinese company, but just be . . . no, I can’t find out. And I went on a crusade on Twitter to try to figure out who owns them. They still will not tell me. All right, anyway.

Paula: No. They never want you to know, I’m sure.

Andrew: This is where I get [inaudible 00:39:01].

Paula: Well, I hope you found out good things on me, so. I encourage you . . .

Andrew: I did. And don’t get me wrong, I was looking for bad stuff. It’s not that you’re a bad person or bad entrepreneur with bad stuff, I just want to know it. And if it’s nothing but you trying to use me, then I want to be aware of that too so that I can say no gently and move on. And if it is good, I want to find that out too.

All right, this is a long like diatribe that I went on. Let me say this, guys, I should talk about my second sponsor. It’s a company called Toptal. Since I’ve been yapping too much, I’m not going to make it long. You already know, if you need to hire a developer, not a really bad developer, inexpensively that you’re going to work with, and train, and get them up and running, no but a really good developer and not one that’s going to take you weeks and months to put listings on everywhere and you’re going to be proud of your hiring process, which takes you months and then sets you back timewise, if you really want a great developer, super fast, do what I do, challenge this ad, go to toptal.com/mixergy and see if I’m full of it.

You don’t have to hire anybody. You just go to that page, you start a conversation with a matcher, and you say, “Andrew told me you’re the best of the best. Show me. Prove it to me.” And if they prove it to you by putting two great developers in front of you, and you want to hire one of them, great, you hire them. And if you still think this doesn’t work out for you, they’ve got a two-week trial period. They will not charge you, but they will still pay the developer. And if you decide you’re still happy with them, it gets better and better. They’ll give you 80 hours of Toptal developer credit when you pay for your first 80 hours. All you have to do is go to toptal.com/mixergy since I am a New Yorker, just like . . . who is that guy like, Glen Nelson . . .

Paula: Glen Nelson.

Andrew: . . . who talked very fast and very in your face. I will say slowly, it’s top as in top of your head, tal as in talent . . .

Paula: What city are you from?

Andrew: I grew up in Queens.

Paula: Ah, so I worked in Long Island with him.

Andrew: For Glen?

Paula: All over with Glen. All over, yes.

Andrew: I hated Long Island growing up there. There’s no sidewalks. There’s no lights at night. It’s like, “I come from New York, lots of sidewalks, walk everywhere, lots of light . . . “

Paula: Not there.

Andrew: I was like 17 years old driving through Long Island. They got no sidewalks. You have to drive everywhere, no lights so you can’t see anything. And then, once you get there . . .

Paula: What did you do?

Andrew: And then I discovered when I was older and I was dating somebody who had family that had a house on Long Island, like a beach house, I realized, “This is why people come.” Beautiful beach houses, go out at night and you party in these places that look like dives. But that’s the thing. If you’re willing to spend $100 on a drink, there’s no better place to spend it, at a dive bar in Long Island with interesting people who end it turns out . . .

Paula: And then you get on with [inaudible 00:41:24] the city.

Andrew: Sorry?

Paula: I said then you can get on the train and go into the city when you want.

Andrew: Yes.

Paula: Just ride on the little train.

Andrew: Which is probably better than driving in. And you discover these people, yeah, they’re in flip flops and just kind of hanging out, but they’re running the whole finance business of the world. All right, I should close it out, top as in top of your head, tal as in talent, T-O-P-T-A-L.com/M-I-X-E-R-G-Y, toptal.com/mixergy, challenge them the way that I challenge myself and challenge my guests.

All right, so you pull it out, you start to sell on your own site and Amazon. For Amazon. What did you do to close sales on Amazon? What did you do to get people to buy?

Paula: Yeah, it’s one of those things. It’s just the product has been so well received and the reviews have been so good that customers found it and started buying it and reviews just came. So to get up into rankings on Amazon, of course it takes reviews and satisfied customers. So right now, we just can’t even keep enough products sent to Amazon to even keep our numbers out of the negatives. So we have . . .

Andrew: Well, one of the things that I understood that you did was you did the first . . . like the delivery by Amazon FSA, what is it . . . ?

Paula: FBA.

Andrew: FBA.

Paula: Fulfilled by Amazon.

Andrew: Fulfilled by Amazon. Obrigado. I’m spacing out. You did that early on when it was kind of a newer thing, when it was going to cost you more money to have them do it. You said, “I’m going to trust them. I’m getting out of the business of dealing with this and shipping it. I’m going to take it to Amazon,” and you jumped on that fast.

Paula: I did FBA about three years ago and I had a person that came to work for me who said they understood the FBA process. And of course they didn’t, but they said they did enough that I trusted them to get us started and get our feet wet. I didn’t understand how to give something a SKU number and get it in the system. And I thought I had to go make a lot of changes to my packaging. You know, I didn’t even have a barcode on my product at that time. So I was only in these retailer stores so I didn’t need all of that. But I thought that . . .

Andrew: You didn’t need a barcode in the retailer store? They don’t need to swipe through the . . . ?

Paula: You know, these are not sophisticated retailers, your mom and pop retailers. They weren’t scanning in anything . . .

Andrew: What about Camping World, weren’t they doing it? Oh, this was before Camping World. Entendi.

Paula: This was before.

Andrew: Got it.

Paula: Yeah, this was some years. I remember the first month on Amazon, I did $500 in sales. I was like, “Well, yeah, whatever,” you know, $500, that’s not so bad. We weren’t in FBA at that time. We were still fulfilling it ourselves. We’d get the order from Amazon and sent it to the customer. So, you know, that was our first little step into the water, and the next month it was $550 or something like that. It didn’t take a big leap. But we didn’t have many products there. And we continued to kind of throw more at it and just watch the numbers begin to move and started watching those numbers against all different channels, all the revenue streams that we had, one being the retailer, one being, you know, Camping World, one being Do it Best, one being our own website, and one being Amazon.

And right now, Amazon has surpassed our own website, and I feel like that’s going to continue to grow. And like I said, we just received our filling equipment while I’m sitting here with you. It’s delivering right now to our back dock. And it’ll make 8000 quarts of paint a day. And you can do the math, but we’re going to be fulfilling Amazon FBA fulfillment for Canada for the Amazon warehouse Canada and Europe. So we’re going to really turn it up, turn up the crank here this year, so. Let’s see what it’s going to do.

Andrew: Who is this woman?

Paula: I’m sorry?

Andrew: Who is this woman who came in, she took this on? Yeah, who is this woman? Is this Melissa?

Paula: This is that little girl, her dad handed her $10,000 and said, “Hey, drive up to Chicago and pay those people . . . “

Andrew: This was you and are there person who figured out how to get you on an Amazon, the barcode, the person who hired who didn’t have much experience . . . ?

Paula: Oh, this person, oh, this person. She was just a girl that was doing graphic design in my building who told me she knew how to do Amazon. She didn’t know how. She knew enough to get it. She told me, “You don’t have to have a barcode. You can just go over here and buy barcodes from a barcode generator website.” And you know, that wasn’t something you could do some years ago. And we assigned barcodes to the products that we put on Amazon. So that’s how we kind of started the process. And then, you know, I brought everything in-house. And I think that’s been another important thing is I always try to bring everything in-house and control every aspect of our product.

And I’m a big proponent of it doesn’t matter how many take, it matters how much you keep at the end of the day, and I try to guard every dollar from the container to the label to the labor that we put into the package and everything about that. So I look at all aspects of the product and see how we can maintain the high quality that we have, as well as make a better product faster to market. So that’s what it’s all about.

So we’ve made our own labels. We print our own labels. We just got a brand new label printing machine that cuts the label and prints it on a beautiful material as well as this filling equipment. So, you know, we just moved. We moved five times in the last six years, and we just moved into a brand new place.

Andrew: Did you just move into a church recently or . . . ? Was that one of the last ones?

Paula: Bought a church. No, that was three moves ago. We moved to a church. I bought a church that I found on Craigslist.

Andrew: You bought the whole church?

Paula: Bought the whole church and the land around it. Sim. With the idea that . . .

Andrew: Why own your place?

Paula: Sorry?

Andrew: Why did you want to own your place?

Paula: Well, at the time, when we first started the business, we were renting in a commercial park, in a business park and we were renting different buildings that were not even contiguous space to each other because we were growing so quickly. And, you know, at the time, we thought, “Wow, this is huge. This is 6,000 square feet.” And then we went over and rented another one that was 4,000 and so on. So, you know, we kept growing and growing. And so I said, “You know, here’s the kicker, I don’t know this business, I was getting uncomfortable renting all this space,” because I said, “These people won’t an IOU. If we can’t meet the rental payment, they’re going to tell us to move out. So what if the business turns down?” And I’m going to pay this kind of money a month, you know, $7,000, $8,000 rent a month, I’m going to be making a mortgage payment because that way I can control my destiny a little bit.

So that’s when I found the church and I said, “Hey, we can add on to this thing. We can make it what it is.” The church was nothing more than a steel building with a steeple on top. So we removed the steeple and off we went and found out quickly that we couldn’t build on it. This building was in a floodplain. So we sold, leave very quickly and moved again to another location. And we thought it was big enough and we came very close buying that building and quickly outgrew it before our lease was even up. We were looking for more property and we just moved here, and we’re adding on to this building 12,000 square feet. I met with the construction people today. So we’re in 12,000 right now adding 12 in the back, so we’d be at 24. And we need it tomorrow, so.

Andrew: And a large part of this, as we said, is from Amazon, but it’s also from your site. So I’m looking you up on Ahrefs, they’re a partner of ours. I’ve got an account there. I’m trying to see are you doing content marketing to get people over? From what I can see, not really. It seems like it’s advertising.

Paula: Well, I can tell where it is. I can give you 100% where it is.

Andrew: Where is it?

Paula: You know, I started this thing out and you saw my early videos producing them ourselves, and of course, we still do everything ourselves. And I do teaching videos and teaching people how to use our products and paint themselves and giving women and men too, encouraging them to pick up a paintbrush, things they’ve generally gone to or had to pay someone to do and I show them how to use the paint and how to get these results that are professional that they’re going to say, “You know, somebody price painting my kitchen for four grand, I did it for a quart and a half of paint or two, you know, for under $100,” and the little time they did it themselves, so . . .

Andrew: This is content marketing on YouTube, not on your own site?

Paula: No. You know, YouTube has been a great thing for us early on. YouTube was the only thing I needed to do. And of course, Facebook came along with, you know, just the Facebook strategy of the live content and a live feed that you could do, and I started doing a lot of lives, started growing, my audience began to grow. Then we opened a Facebook group, a private group, and that group is at . . . I think 110,000 people and they’re mainly all users of the product.

So, you know, I take my main Facebook page and encourage people to get into our groups so then we can help them, educate them, show them projects, give them ideas on where to use the product around their home and what they can do with it and see other people’s version of it instead of mine. Sometimes, you know, people watch you and they go, “Is this trick photography or whatever?” You never know what people think today because so many things can be done with digital imagery. So the greatest thing is when someone else shares their story, not necessarily my perspective, but their story, so when people see that other people are getting the results outside of the company, then they go, “Hey, this is true. It really does work and they’re not just pulling my leg to get me to buy this,” you know.

So once that corroborates, you know, how easy the product is to use, then that group has been very wonderful for us. And of course, we’re touching about 5 million people right now a month on Facebook. So even though we only have 150 some thousand likes, our engagement, you can check this because you are one of those . . .

Andrew: I’m doing it right now.

Paula: So go and check it out.

Andrew: If you feel like you lost me, you did not. I’m watching everything that you’re saying here and checking it out. Here’s one from . . .

Paula: You can go look at the big boys, look at Sherwin’s, look at all of them, Joanna Gaines, all those and you can see what their engagement is versus our small numbers, 150,000 and then you’ll see . . .

Andrew: I see 107,000 though in the group . . .

Paula: That’s the group.

Andrew: No, you’re right . . . no, the 151 people liked the page . . . oh, I can’t see…

Paula: That’s the private group, that 107.

Andrew: Oh, I do see a public . . . I see a public group with 107 and see . . .

Paula: That’s it. It’s a public group, sorry. I shouldn’t have said private.

Andrew: So there’s a woman named Min who just posted in there now, 11 minutes ago, and she says, “We recently purchased this,” and she’s pointing to cabinets in the picture, “I’m not really liking the colors. What color would you guys recommend?” and then she lists a bunch of colors, and she says, “Thank you for your help.” And then Amanda, seven minutes ago, that’s four minutes after she posted, Amanda came in with some questions and some input, and now the conversation is going beyond where I care to keep going and diving in. But I could see now . . .

Paula: We’ll continue all day and all night.

Andrew: I could see what this group is about. It’s people posting photos of their furniture. There’s one person who posted a photo their couch, “Can I still paint the couch?”

Paula: Sure. You can paint leather and vinyl with this product. Remember me telling you that?

Andrew: Look at these, I love retro, these people are asking, “$60 for this couch, it’s leather. Do you think I could successfully redo it in polo?”

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Paula: Yep.

Andrew: “It’s calling to me.”

Paula: [inaudible 00:52:07] quickly. Yes, you can.

Andrew: So you can? No, I’m not getting into this. But she has 119 comments.

Paula: Hey, help me out.

Andrew: One hundred and nineteen comments of people. I’m not jumping into that one.

Paula: Oh, yeah. The group is where it is, and that’s where we kind of live, you know, about five admin.

Andrew: What about ads? I heard you hired somebody who’s a pro at buying ads. Did that work out for you?

Paula: You know, that’s Melissa, who came in my business about . . . gosh, I think she’s been with me about five years now. I hired her as a bookkeeper, and just try to help me you know, maintain, you know, the status quo of having employees on it. Melissa had never been on the marketing side of business, and I said, “Hey, you know what, you . . . ” she really balances me. You know, I’m kind of a balloon. I mean, she tethers me to the ground a little bit. And she said, “No. I’ve never done marketing before.” And I said, “You know, you work great with me,” because she will throw me an idea, maybe it’s not the idea that I was thinking of, but it gives me something to go for. And together, we bounce things off of each other very well and balance each other. So she’s now the general manager of the business, and I let her kind of run with everything. She is fantastic. There’s no words . . .

Andrew: And I heard for a long time, you didn’t get paid but she got paid because you guys were running low. You’re wincing. Did I get that wrong or what?

Paula: Yeah, because this business . . . I’ll have to go back it up just a bit because whenever I started the business, again, in my kitchen, I met someone about that time, and he and I were . . . you know, it wasn’t long that we were living under the same roof together. He was in a great business himself. He has come up in the insurance business, and Craig is his name. So he was doing really well and had all of his life. He’s in his 50s. And, you know, he made a six-figure income on his own. So he didn’t need my help, but he was encouraging me to do this business. And I was like, “Okay, you know, with your support,” and, you know, he and I were in love and whatever, so he said, “I want you to quit traveling. And I want you to really get in here and do this business.” So I said, “All right, with that encouragement, I’m going to do it.” So I did it, and going to New York during that time. So I was full force into this. And wasn’t taking any money out of the business because there wasn’t much to take to begin with. So I was leaving it alone.

And in a very short span of time, I’m going to say six months into this, Craig calls me on a Thursday afternoon, and he said, “You’re not going to believe this.” He was working out in Seattle, where he was from originally. He was traveling back out there, the company he worked for, Delta Dental, he was back out in Seattle working every other week out there, and he said, “I lost my job.” And then I said, “No way.” He said, “I wouldn’t kid about that.” So he was very emotional and upset about it. And I said, “Well, come join me in this business.”

And so he laughed. He said, “You know that you really understand what you’re saying,” and we got three children and a daughter getting married who’s expecting a big wedding by her daddy and, you know, I’ve got another son in college and one in high school and I also had one and both of our boys were in private school. So I was like, “Wow, what are we going to do now?” And I said, “Just come and help me. I could never pay for you to be in the business. But now that we don’t have an option . . . ” He said, “No, you know, I need to get back in insurance. I’m going to go work for Blue Cross.” So he had that opportunity. And I said, “Well, you know, if you want to go back in the insurance business, or you want to come help me.”

And of course, he is colorblind, he’d never painted a stick of anything in his life, had no interest in anything in the DIY world and I said, “Just come and help me.” And so he started kind of dabbling, helping me to try to feel better I think, and with all intentions of going back into the insurance world. But he said, “Let’s go over and lease a building.” So we went out and leased this first building. There was a flex space office in the front, warehouse in the back, so 1,800 square feet. So we moved into that, and he started helping me shoot those videos, like the one you first saw, that little video. That was one we did. He was going to try to script me and tell me what I needed to say in these videos. And so that is absolutely impossible.

I just have to talk, you know, “This is me. I’ve just got to talk.” So in other words, he didn’t do well as a director, directing me anyway so. So long story short, we immediately, as he came into the business, he said he had $100,000 that . . . well, no, no, let me take that back. He had a pension from where he’d worked and some other insurance business before, that hundred grand, and then he had a severance of three months. He said, “I’ve got three months of severance. After that, I don’t know what we’ll do.” So I had all of those houses I told you that I still owned in Tennessee and a great deal of expenses coming out for son in school, his boys, you know, all of that. So, ah, it was a fun moment. And I said, “Just get in here and let’s dig, let’s go to work.” And, you know, again, he was a fish out of water, but I just got in there and rock and roll. And we never missed paycheck and still haven’t to this day.

I think this was worth mentioning and I believe that’s what you’re recalling there from the paperwork is when one of the last Do it Best markets that we went to, we had gone out, the Do it Best market is in Indianapolis two times a year. It’s very expensive, about 20 grand for us to go, not to mention the time away and all the expense to get there. The booth itself was 20 grand. So they do pretty good on these little adventures here, these booths they charge for. And so we’d gone out to Las Vegas, to the national hardware show. So we had our booth out there and then picked it up and shipped it up to Indianapolis just for the following week to go for that show.

When we arrived in Indianapolis, our booth was totally destroyed. It was just sitting there in a heap of woodpile. The party starting this off as a disaster. And so Melissa and I are there trying to put it together and make heads or tails of this thing. And Craig calls because he’s still in Louisville, he calls to tell me that really an issue that Melissa’s paycheck was not going to cash. So that was probably the lowest low that I can recall that was the low of the low because this was also the worst market because they have a good one and the slow one, this was the slow market. This is the one you’d generally don’t see many people that you haven’t already met before because nobody new shows up to this.

So one customer rolled in the door, that was the iconic member at Do it Best that everybody would say my product is at this store. These guys rolled into our booth and put it in all of their locations. So thank God that was 50 grand worth of business again, if that hadn’t happened. I don’t know where we would have ended up after that day. Her check cashed. That’s the only time that’s ever happened. And I think that was another reckoning moment or just a moment for me to think, “This doesn’t work. What we’re doing here is enriching these guys really, and why am I doing that? Why am I throwing $42,000 in a booth to rent to go stand in a little booth to try to sell my product to people I’ve put into their warehouse who do nothing to help support it or help to sell it, and rather than doing that, why don’t I just give a break to these people who are already loving my product that I’m talking to every single day?” So it just rolled back to that again.

And I still remember that old Blockbuster thing going on in my head, you know, whenever you can say . . . how does Gary V say that he wants to order a movie, he’s wanting to do it laying in his underwear in his bed, same way I want to shop off, you know. I don’t need to get up and go to Blockbuster to pick out a video. I’m just going to get on Netflix and buy something tonight, you know. Same thing.

Andrew: You know what, I’m like that too. I don’t want to go to any store and buy anything unless it’s like to keep the kids entertained. So that’s why I go to Target, which I’ve never been to before I had kids, and I said, “Let’s just walk in here,” walk into any store and see what things . . .

Paula: Let these kids run.

Andrew: But they love everything. I take them to Home Depot even though I never buy anything from Home Depot, but they get to go in the shower, pretend they’re taking a shower in one of the showers on display. The thing though that I imagine is if I wanted to buy paint, wouldn’t I want to go to a store to make sure that it was the right color? Because I’ve got an iPad here in front of me that I like, it’s showing one color, I see my laptop over here, it’s showing a fainted version of the same color.

Paula: That’s not it.

Andrew: So how do you do it?

Paula: Well, how did we get around that? Just like I told you earlier.

Andrew: How?

Paula: If you believe that this paint product is something that you want to try, we want to put the product in your hand. Now, this would have sank you if this product didn’t exceed the customer’s expectations, meaning if I’m going to send you a sample and my customer acquisition costs are high in that, and they are, I’m going to send you a $16.99 jar of paint and the only thing you pay is the $6.99 shipping, I’m at a loss of about $3 per person every time that comes through, and I’m going to put that into your hand and you pick a color that you think you like, but inside that box is coming this strip of colors that are all spot on . . .

Andrew: Show me all the others.

Paula: . . . matches to the paint. So now, you have the paint, you can make the decision if you like the product and how it looks and feels and did it deliver what you thought, and now if you like it, you can pick it out because you’ve got the color in your hand. So that’s the only way we could win at this without being on the shelf somewhere.

Andrew: And I could also get a color card for $3. Right?

Paula: Yep. You can buy that too.

Andrew: But the thing is that I could go into a store and just see it immediately and then see competitors too. Why are people choosing to wait? Why are people choosing to pay where they could just go to the store and see it for free?

Paula: Well, all right, so let’s say you go to Lowes, Home Depot today. First of all, you got to find some human that knows something because most people in there don’t know doggone thing? I’m going to be bombarded with 75,000 color options. Most people today are confused on what color looks good because they can look at those little chips and once they take that home, that’s not exactly what they thought it would be either. So we’ve given these colors a lot of thought. We’ve digested these colors. In other words, we’ve painted a lot of projects. You can also go in that group and see all kinds of projects where people are showing it in different lighting, in the daylight, in the nightlight, in different homes, you know. And they can see it, and feel it, and touch it.

You go into Lowes, Home Depot, and all these colors, you’re not going to really see these colors on anything. You’re just going to take a stab in the dark and go, “Well, that looks like a shade of green,” and I get at home and then in my light the shade of green all of a sudden it’s a shade of brown. And, you know, so all of those . . .

Andrew: I see. So, here, for example, Sharon [Pluff 01:02:32] 15 hours ago showed a picture of a dresser that has . . . it looks like wood veneer on it, and then she showed the different paint and how she did it. Entendi. And you know what, that does resonate with me. I don’t even . . . when it comes to buying computer equipment for example, I don’t necessarily want to go into the store anymore and see it. What I want us to see a bunch of Youtubers beat it up, a bunch of real users put it to use so I see what’s possible, talk about the problems with it so I know what the dangers are, and then I’m interested. I don’t even want to go into a store and see it for myself.

Paula: Because nobody knows anything. You know as well as I do. No one knows anything. Go in to Best Buy and ask if they’ve got a computer, or wherever, you’re not going to any knowledge . . .

Andrew: No. My least favorite is I do go to . . . I have in the past gone to Home Depot when I needed something, I can’t even find them to come help me.

Paula: Good luck with that.

Andrew: They act like they’re doing me a favor when you know what, I’m lost here. Like, can you just be a little nice here? Can you help me out? Or at least have a stupid app that tells me where stuff is, if it’s too distracting for you to hear me ask where can I get some wood so my kid can learn how to . . .

Paula: They want you to bother them.

Andrew: . . . pound some nails into it. Certo. I’m not going to keep ripping into it. That does answer my question. I’ve gotten a lot . . . oh, I did have two things written down here. I was about to say goodbye, and then I realized this would have been such a good place to end it, but I’m kind of an anal person. I do have to come back and ask two things that are my checklist. Number one, what’s the travel product that you brought up earlier?

Paula: Oh, my goodness. Well, as you know, being a designer, I don’t just design houses. I’ve designed everything, you know. I did a lot of stage wear for country music entertainers for a lot of years and so sewing is second nature to me, started doing it very young. So whenever my friend, I told you Glen Nelson, the guy that I worked for in New York when he was killed in a car accident, I went up to the wake and on the plane ride up there I was just . . . where it’s flown so much in so many years and had neck problems and developed a lot of issues from that. I decided that . . . I have just this brainstorm just comes to me, this is what works. I’d thrown away so many pillows, never even carry one, buy the newest, greatest, latest thing and never even put it in my bag. So it didn’t work for me.

I had a revolution in my mind, and I thought I know this works. I got home, couldn’t wait to sit down in front of my sewing machine. I said this is from him. You know, he loved entrepreneurs. He invested in a lot of different crazy ideas out there. Got a lot of his money taken actually. But I said, at the sewing machine sawed this up, called an attorney, someone told me, “You need to call this patent attorney,” called him up and said, “Hey, do you think this is something that’s patentable? I mean I had no idea even the terminology.” He said, “Let me look into it.” He calls me up and he says, “It is actually.” He said, “Yours is the only product out there that’s made like this, that actually would work.” I said, “You got to be kidding me.” He said, “No.” He said, “There’s thousands of pillows and neck pillows, designs of pillows that wrap around the seat and all that,” but mine didn’t wrap around the seat.

Mine come from the rear of the seat and it come over the back of the seat so no matter if your head extended the height of the seat. And it’s the size of an iPhone, so it’s not this big cumbersome thing around the neck. It actually just stops forward head motion. It clips on it. it has retracting push button cord rails. So it’s just this tiny little device you just put it on over your eyes, or forehead, or under your neck, either way, wherever you want to wear it. And it just goes down this nice little pouch. It’s called Sleep Upright. And it is phenomenal. I launched it on Kickstarter. It did about $275,000 in sales. And from there, it just kind of had a little life of its own. And I just got awarded a patent by the USPTO for a utility patent for it.

Andrew: I don’t mean to correct you, but I think it did $307,274.

Paula: Well, that was combined with Indiegogo. So yeah, did a little more. It’s done a lot more.

Andrew: That’s what I see on Kickstarter, but I get the sense of it.

Paula: That was . . . they blend those. I don’t know why they blend those.

Andrew: Oh, they do blend it? Oh

Paula: They do.

Andrew: That’s interesting.

Paula: I don’t know why because they’re two different platforms, crazy as they are. They did blend them

Andrew: And they don’t like each other but . . .

Paula: You don’t know why they do that.

Andrew: So that’s interesting. So the way it works is you attach it to your headrest and then it goes in front of your face so you can put it under your chin or whatever, and that way it holds you back up to the headrest. If you fall asleep, your head will fall down without falling into your lap.

Paula: Yeah, pretty cool.

Andrew: Got it. Tudo certo. This is amazing. This story isn’t . . . oh, this would have been a great place to end it too. Here’s where I’m going to end it, kind of awkward but if only I could ask you before we got started, you said, “Andrew, you could ask me anything even what my age is.”

Paula: You can.

Andrew: So I wrote it down in the checklist item. How old are you?

Paula: I just turned 57, I think. Goodnight.

Andrew: Fifty-seven.

Paula: ’63 is when I’m born. Is that correct? I am the worst . . . I try to forget how old I am, not because it bothers me. I just don’t care. It just doesn’t matter. But I think I’m 57.

Andrew: I’m like that too, and it blows people’s minds. I get the . . .

Paula: Why?

Andrew: How does it feel to be an entrepreneur that late in life? Not at 20?

Paula: You know, I’m glad to be sitting where I’m sitting at this age. And I always look back and go, “Could I have handled this as a younger person?” No. The answer to that is a big old flat no. Nope, I would have been out buying things I shouldn’t have bought. Tied the money up in the wrong things. Nowadays, the focus is on the right end of the stick. I know what to do, where to go. I’m taking all of my things I’ve learned the hard way, and this is probably the first time in my life I’m able to say all the negatives, I’m going to turn them [inaudible 01:07:38] right here. I got a lot of people depending on me, so a lot of employees.

Andrew: The website, for anyone who wants to go check it out . . . I’ve seen a couple of sites, but the one that I’m going to recommend they go check is allinonepaint.com. That’s yours.

Paula: Yep. É isso aí. We have a lot of URLs, and they’re all on HostGator by the way.

Andrew: Oh, they are. Oh, right on.

Paula: They are. They were. Sim. I think so still.

Andrew: And then, of course, there’s all the Facebook groups where you can see people’s home projects. And I’m really grateful to you for doing this interview and for being so open. I want to thank the two sponsors who made this interview happen, as you heard HostGator. A lot of people who I’ve talked to started out on HostGator. You should too. Go to hostgator.com/mixergy. And if you’re hiring a developer, challenge me, challenge yourself, challenge Toptal. If it doesn’t work out, you don’t have to sign up. But if you do like them, you can hire people who are going to blow your mind at toptal.com/mixergy, T-O-P-T-A-L.com/mixergy. Paula, thanks so much for being here.

Paula: Hey, thank you for having me. I’ve enjoyed it immensely. Obrigado.

Andrew: Thanks, bye, everyone.

Paula: Bye.



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